A&P Ratings Misconceptions

6 posts / 0 new
Last post
Stacheair1
Stacheair1's picture
A&P Ratings Misconceptions

Over the years I keep receiving the same type of questions concern the Airframe and Powerplant ratings. They is no secret to what is required to meet the Federal Aviation Regulations to be allow to test as an aviation mechanic to the U.S. Code part 65. All of the information concerning A&P ratings, eligible, duration, and testing is contained in part 65. Below I have cited the certification rules and provided an comments that may answer most of the misconceptions about out ratings.

Title 14: Aeronautics and Space
PART 65—Certification: Airmen Other Than Flight Crewmembers

§65.1 Applicability.
This part 65 prescribes the requirements for issuing the following certificates and associated ratings and the general operating rules for the holders of those certificates and ratings:
(a) Air-traffic control-tower operators.
(b) Aircraft dispatchers.
(c) Mechanics.
(d) Repairmen.
(e) Parachute riggers

§65.11 Application and issue.
(a) Application for a certificate and appropriate class rating, or for an additional rating, under this part must be made on a form and in a manner prescribed by the Administrator. (For us mechanics we do this on FAA Form 8610-2 available for download from the FAA website.)

There are some restrictions on the rating as well such as; §65.12 Offenses involving alcohol or drugs. (1) Denial of an application for any certificate or rating issued under this part for a period of up to 1 year after the date of final conviction. What this means is you can still test and receive an FAA rating 1 year after the date of final conviction and the FAA Form 8610-2 has a block for this information.

Because of the terrorists attracts on the U.S. some new rules now apply as well.
§65.14 Security disqualification.
(a) Eligibility standard. No person is eligible to hold a certificate, rating, or authorization issued under this part when the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) has notified the FAA in writing that the person poses a security threat.

(b) Effect of the issuance by the TSA of an Initial Notification of Threat Assessment. (1) The FAA will hold in abeyance pending the outcome of the TSA's final threat assessment review an application for any certificate, rating, or authorization under this part by any person who has been issued an Initial Notification of Threat Assessment by the TSA.

For us mechanics we fall under Subpart D—Mechanics to meet the FAA requirement to be allowed to test. These rules have not change and are still in effect.

§65.71 Eligibility requirements: General
a) To be eligible for a mechanic certificate and associated ratings, a person must—
(1) Be at least 18 years of age;
(2) Be able to read, write, speak, and understand the English language, or in the case of an applicant who does not meet this requirement and who is employed outside of the United States by a U.S. air carrier, have his certificate endorsed “Valid only outside the United States”;
(3) Have passed all of the prescribed tests within a period of 24 months; and
(4) Comply with the sections of this subpart that apply to the rating he seeks.

(b) A certificated mechanic who applies for an additional rating must meet the requirements of §65.77 and, within a period of 24 months, pass the tests prescribed by §§65.75 and 65.79 for the additional rating sought.

I should note the 24 month time period starts when an applicant takes the first written test for the mechanic test. What this means is there is no time limit leading up to this starting point. As an example you could of graduated from a A&P Part 147 aviation program and have your graduation certificate in hand this is still good. You can take your graduation certificate to any Flight Standard District Office (FSDO) and have an FAA Form 8610-2 signed by an FAA inspector in accordance with part 65.11 “a form and in a manner prescribed by the Administrator” to start the testing process. There is no time limit when to start only after you take the first written test.

§65.77 Experience requirements
Each applicant for a mechanic certificate or rating must present either an appropriate graduation certificate or certificate of completion from a certificated aviation maintenance technician school or documentary evidence, satisfactory to the Administrator, of—

(a) At least 18 months of practical experience with the procedures, practices, materials, tools, machine tools, and equipment generally used in constructing, maintaining, or altering airframes, or powerplants appropriate to the rating sought; or

(b) At least 30 months of practical experience concurrently performing the duties appropriate to both the airframe and powerplant ratings.

The experience requirements has not changed for hands on training, however an applicant will have to provide proof of practical experience and this is done in the form of a letter in most cases signed by an Airframe and Powerplant mechanic that supervised that practical experience.

Part-Time Practical Experience
During the evaluation of part-time practical aviation maintenance experience, the applicant must document an equivalent of 18 months for each rating individually, or 30 months of experience for both ratings. This is based on a standard work-week that has 8 hours per day for 5 days per week, or a 40 hour work-week, or a total of approximately 160 hours per month. The time is cumulative, but the days, weeks, and months are not required to be consecutive. The practical experience must be documented.

Programs without Approval
Applicants who have not graduated from an FAA-approved AMTS or JSAMTCC A&P certification program must present documents from an employer, coworker, or other sources satisfactory to the Administrator to establish the required record of time and experience.

Aviation Maintenance Technician School
For those that attended and graduated from an aviation school will have a graduation certificate or certificate of completion from a certificated aviation maintenance technician school this is your evidence nothing more is needed.

Military Certification
A recent Federal Aviation Administration (FAA)/JSAMTCC plan provides for military applicant certification integrity by completely specifying the applicant’s military training and experience in a level of detail that exceeds the minimum standards set forth in Title 14 of the Code of Federal Regulations (14 CFR) part 65, § 65.77(b) for Aviation Maintenance Technician Schools (AMTS). Authorized persons in the applicant’s branch of service must certify this training and/or experience and record it on the joint service Form CG-G-EAE-2, FAA Certification Performance of Job Tasks. The U.S. Coast Guard (USCG) has used this form to certify eligibility for A&P certification for many years, and the Department of Defense (DOD) has now adopted it as a standard form for personnel certification.

Eligibility Military
The appropriate office in each of the joint services will then use the data on Form CG-G-EAE-2 to issue Form CG-G-EAE-4, Certificate of Eligibility to each qualifying applicant. The applicant may then present the completed Certificate of Eligibility and the FAA Certification Performance of Job Tasks form to a Flight Standards District Office (FSDO) as evidence that he/she qualifies for testing authorization under § 65.77. This certificate will serve the same qualification function as a Certificate of Completion or Graduation from a 14 CFR part 147 AMTS.

Military applicants that have not completed the JSAMTCC program may still be evaluated for authorization to take the mechanic knowledge test based on documented experience and military occupational specialty (MOS), Air Force Specialty Code (AFSC), or Navy Enlisted Code (NEC) codes, as authorized in § 65.77. However, when evaluating military experience, aviation safety inspectors (ASI) and ASTs are not to accept MOSs, AFSCs, or NECs “carte blanche” as qualifications to accepting experience of § 65.77. Even though the MOSs suggest authorization, the applicant must have verifiable experience in 50 percent of the subject areas listed for the rating sought (refer to part 147 appendices B, C, and D) in order to be eligible.

Language Requirements
All applicants must be able to read, write, speak, and understand English. Refer to the current edition of Advisory Circular (AC) 60-28, English Language Skill Standards Required by 14 CFR parts 61, 63, and 65, which states for all certification testing, the applicant needs to read a section of a technical manual, and then write and explain his/her interpretation of the reading. (An appropriate technical manual in this sense means an Airplane Flight Manual (AFM), maintenance manual, or other publication, as appropriate for the certificate or rating sought.)

Foreign Applicants
For foreign applicants located in the United States, all of the requirements for a citizen of the United States apply. This includes applicants who come to the United States just to take the mechanic test.

ORAL AND PRACTICAL SKILL TEST PREREQUISITES
Applicants for a mechanic certificate and/or added rating(s) must meet the applicable knowledge and skill test requirements of § 65.79.

Test Reports
Applicants for the oral and practical tests must present a valid airman test report (with raised, embossed seal) from a computer test center to show proof of successful completion of all sections of the knowledge test. The appropriate knowledge tests are the Aviation Mechanic General (AMG) Aviation Mechanic Airframe (AMA), and Aviation Mechanic Powerplant (AMP), depending on the rating sought. Section 65.71(a)(3) and requires the passage of all of the prescribed tests, which include the knowledge, oral, and practical skill tests, within a 24-month period.

You can find additional information in FAA Order 8900.1 Volume 5, Section 5, Section 2 by going to http://fsims.faa.gov/

If you have additional questions please contact and I will provide you back with an answer and where I found it.

field_vote: 
0
No votes yet
Buddy
Buddy's picture

Hey Denny, correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the 24 months relative to the testing only began after the first test was passed, not when the first test was attempted.

In essence, an individual could fail and retest 30 times in the next 5 years, and thats OK, but as soon as the individual passes the first test, that is when the 24 month clock starts.

On another note: I have helped a lot of technicians prepare their experience documentation to be presented to the FAA. I have found Advisory Circular 65-2D to be extremely helpful as a basic framework because it breaks down a vast array of subjects in great detail.

Stacheair1
Stacheair1's picture

To answer your questions about the when the clock starts FAA Order 8900.1 Vol 5, Chapter 5, section 2 states within 24 month period. What this means is the FAA Form 8610-2 is the authorization to take the three required tests. The start time is when the first written test is taken pass or fail in accordance with part 65 section 65.71(a)(3) and (b). An applicant can retake the written tests many times to pass, but the time starts by the date on the first written test report. If an applicant fails written test and retakes it and passes the original test date will appear on their report along with the number of retests taken.

5-1136 ORAL AND PRACTICAL SKILL TEST PREREQUISITES. Applicants for a mechanic certificate and/or added rating(s) must meet the applicable knowledge and skill test requirements of § 65.79.

A. Test Reports. Applicants for the oral and practical tests must present a valid airman test report (with raised, embossed seal) from a computer test center to show proof of successful completion of all sections of the knowledge test. The appropriate knowledge tests are the Aviation Mechanic General (AMG) Aviation Mechanic Airframe (AMA), and Aviation Mechanic Powerplant (AMP), depending on the rating sought. Section 65.71(a)(3) and (b) requires the passage of all of the prescribed tests, which include the knowledge, oral, and practical skill tests, within a 24 month period.

The new Practical Test Standard (PTS) is what the practical is based on now and the 24 core items have gone away on the test as before. On the written tests there are Human Factor questions and as I understand Human Factor oral questions will be added at some point on the oral exam, but there are none currently.

Buddy
Buddy's picture

Excellent, Thanks so much.

Tim Morris (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Great presentation on the A&P Ratings!

I kinda knew about the TSA security thing but I never really knew how it worked and where it could be found.

At the community college we had a guy in classes who was a convicted felon (grand theft auto) and he was in the public education system on a program that helps convicts find work.

We had a discussion with him about the application requirements and he talked to our FAA Principal Inspector. The PI did not rule out his elegibility but it would have taken some special consideration.

As it worked out, other distractions prevented him from finishing the program. I don't know what happened to the guy.

There is definitely more to this now than when I received my certificate.

I enjoyed reading your post.

Tim Morris

Stacheair1
Stacheair1's picture

Below is the TSR rule and offenses that may/will bar a person from obtaining an A&P rating.

Title 49 Code of Federal Regulations
TSR 1544

Disqualifying criminal offenses
Federal Register / Vol. 71, No. 102 / Friday, May 26, 2006 / Rules and Regulations
49 C.F.R. §1544.229 Fingerprint-based criminal history records checks (CHRC): Unescorted access authority, authority to perform screening functions, and authority to perform checked baggage or cargo functions.

§1544.229 Fingerprint-based criminal history records checks (CHRC): Unescorted access authority, authority to perform screening functions, and authority to perform checked baggage or cargo functions.

(d) Disqualifying criminal offenses. An individual has a disqualifying criminal offense if the individual has been convicted, or found not guilty by reason of insanity, of any of the disqualifying crimes listed in this paragraph in any jurisdiction during the 10 years before the date of the individual's application for authority to perform covered functions, or while the individual has authority to perform covered functions. The disqualifying criminal offenses are as follows:

(1) Forgery of certificates, false marking of aircraft, and other aircraft registration violation; 49 U.S.C. 46306.
(2) Interference with air navigation; 49 U.S.C. 46308.
(3) Improper transportation of a hazardous material; 49 U.S.C. 46312.
(4) Aircraft piracy; 49 U.S.C. 46502.
(5) Interference with flight crew members or flight attendants; 49 U.S.C. 46504.
(6) Commission of certain crimes aboard aircraft in flight; 49 U.S.C. 46506.
(7) Carrying a weapon or explosive aboard aircraft; 49 U.S.C. 46505.
(8) Conveying false information and threats; 49 U.S.C. 46507.
(9) Aircraft piracy outside the special aircraft jurisdiction of the United States; 49 U.S.C. 46502(b).
(10) Lighting violations involving transporting controlled substances; 49 U.S.C. 46315.
(11) Unlawful entry into an aircraft or airport area that serves air carriers or foreign air carriers contrary to established security requirements; 49 U.S.C. 46314.
(12) Destruction of an aircraft or aircraft facility; 18 U.S.C. 32.
(13) Murder.
(14) Assault with intent to murder.
(15) Espionage.
(16) Sedition.
(17) Kidnapping or hostage taking.
(18) Treason.
(19) Rape or aggravated sexual abuse.
(20) Unlawful possession, use, sale, distribution, or manufacture of an explosive or weapon.
(21) Extortion.
(22) Armed or felony unarmed robbery.
(23) Distribution of, or intent to distribute, a controlled substance.
(24) Felony arson.
(25) Felony involving a threat.
(26) Felony involving—
(i) Willful destruction of property;
(ii) Importation or manufacture of a controlled substance;
(iii) Burglary;
(iv) Theft;
(v) Dishonesty, fraud, or misrepresentation;
(vi) Possession or distribution of stolen property;
(vii) Aggravated assault;
(viii) Bribery; or
(ix) Illegal possession of a controlled substance punishable by a maximum term of imprisonment of more than 1 year.
(27) Violence at international airports; 18 U.S.C. 37.
(28) Conspiracy or attempt to commit any of the criminal acts listed in this paragraph (d).

Log in or register to post comments